Good point about the materials of war. However, the colonists were fighting on their own soil, familiar with local conditions, able to stockpile weapons anywhere within the entire territory. It's a terrific advantage, something the US knows both as colonists and colonizers. The costs of occupation are acceptable to the occupiers because they mainly sustained by the lower classes.
The US constitution has served as a model for similar documents for other countries. However, the good ideas are pretty universal. These come up again and again because they are good ideas, and people like them. They'd come up with them whether they were in the US Constitution or not - like the golden rule, which appears in all major religions - I'll give you a nickel if you can prove which one came up with it first, but there is something peculiarly arrogant about the desert religions that dominate the west - they each want to claim an exclusive lock on virtue and truth. The idea of exceptionalism is bunk, whether the religious practice involves sky gods or political gods.
The US handling of the indigenous population is a great illustration, thank you for bringing it up. One thing that lead to the founding of the nation was colonial impatience with how the British were dealing with the natives. They insisted on negotiating with them rather than simply shoving them aside and killing them. The colonists were impatient to capture their resources; they had their way, and it's been go go go ever since.
Canada proceeded along the British model, and while things are awful for natives there too, they are marginally better.
If my position is "typical", it's because it's true. I bring up instances of abuse because in my philosophy, sweeping statements require supporting evidence. These aren't isolated instances, but rather part of a rich, seamless tapestry of abuse. It would take time to report them all, but as it happens, I have lots of time.
Or we can talk about what's great about this country. All the stuff that came from us, that's what's great about it. Ice cream cones. Quilts. The Ramones. Civil Rights. All the stuff that came from us, gained through struggle. They like to claim they gave to us, and we foolishly allow ourselves to believe them.
On 6/3/07, Matt Love < matt.mattlove1@gmail.com > wrote:> Who at the time would have predicted that the rag-tag American Colonists could defeat the British Army and Navy?
Maybe that's where the smart money was. The British Empire, was
pre-occupied with the French Empire at the time. The colonists had
the advantage of being on their home territory, and not having supply
lines that stretched across the ocean. Much like the situation the
Vietnamese nationalists were in when under attack by the American
Empire. The Vietnamese also had some assistance from rival empires.
America's supply lines DID stretch across the ocean, Matt. Funded by Dutch bankers from the East India Trading Company, we bought arms that the French brought in by running the Brit's blockade.
Or, is that not across an ocean?? ;)> That battle ushered in the beginning of America, the greatest bastion of freedom for all people that the world had ever known.
Baloney.
Consider the following: On February 5, 1783, Washington received a
letter from Marquis de Lafayette, whom Washington considered both a
friend and a son, that stated, "Let us unite in purchasing a small
estate, where we may try the experiment to free the negroes, and use
them only as tenants. Such an example as yours might render it a
general practice..." Washington was lavish in his praise for the plan,
but refused to join in. Lafayette went on with his plan alone, buying
land in the French colony of Cayenne.
Washington did free his slaves upon his death when he no longer had
need of them, but he did not free the slaves of his wife. While it was
kind of him to provide for her (I'm sure Dubya has similar provisions
in his will), she was forced to free her own slaves during her own
lifetime – the remaining slaves were so agitated by the freeing of
George's slaves that Martha feared for her life.
Jefferson's slaves, in fact, his own desendants, had to wait for the
the civil war for freedom.
It's worth considering inconvenient truths like this when
contemplating statements like "America, the greatest bastion of
freedom for all people that the world had ever known."
It's typical of some people to discount the model of freedom that America brought to the world by bringing up specific instances of abuse. Hell; we massacred a whole nation of indigenous people.
Still, we did bring a MODEL of freedom to the world, if not, in fact, all that it was cracked up to be. We were still, at the time, one of the freest countries in the world.
Now, we're one of the most repressive, and Bush is doing what Hitler and Saddam did; getting people to be complicit.
In SERE school, we were taught to never agree. If they said it was a nice day, we said nothing. If they asked if we liked the food, we said nothing, if they asked if we wanted to see our parents again, we said nothing (or, in each case, we could recite the old name, rank, serial number.) Getting you to agree to even to the benign statement is the start of converting you; of compromising you.
Our Congress, except for a very few (YEA! Russ Feingold!), are on the road to being like the German Parliament of 1933. Check that; not on the road, but at the destination.
Still, we USED to be an example, despite our abuses.
Your argument, Matt, is very much like the Bushies arguments that Bush isn't so bad, because Clinton had sex in the WH.
What is baloney is your specious, empty and irrelevant argument.
On 6/3/07, Kathleen Bushman <sassykathy46@gmail.com > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> http://thepoliticaljunkies.net/ Themdems. htm
> UPDATED: JUN 3, 2007
>
> "THE WORLD TURNED UPSIDE DOWN"
> Mick Walker, TPJ Columnist
>
> When George Washington defeated General Charles Cornwallis at Yorktown in 1781, Cornwallis instructed the British band to play the tune, "The World Turned Upside Down." And indeed, it had. Who at the time would have predicted that the rag-tag American Colonists could defeat the British Army and Navy? That battle ushered in the beginning of America, the greatest bastion of freedom for all people that the world had ever known. And it has been a long run.
>
> I shudder to think about America in the 21st Century and where we stand now, thanks to some of our leaders who have steered us into the dark waters of greed and world dominance. I just wonder what grand scheme Bush and his pseudo-Christian Neocons have in mind for the entire world. With armies, and fearless puppets like Bush and his successors, they just might pull it off. If so, Americans will lose more freedoms, one by one, as they slip away in silence while we flip channels, gripe about prayer in the schools, or whether gays should marry or not.
>
> Maybe it will break like a dam, all at once someday when Washington announces there is no more money in the US Treasury for Social Security, Medicare, and basic Education programs for the kids. Maybe it will dawn on us someday that the Democrats, elected in good faith by the people, should have impeached Bush and Cheney right off the bat. And stopped the Iraq War dead in its tracks. Americans are tired of the war and the warlike image Bush has painted of America for the entire world to see. We said so at the polls in 2006. Imagine how the Iraqis would like us to stop the war and get out immediately. Unlike us, they have to endure the bombs and bullets and exist in their war-torn country that used to be Iraq.
>
> Think Bush and Cheney give a damn? Well, as arrogant as Bush is with his signing statements that override and cancel out legitimate laws passed by our own Congress, I have to doubt that he gives a damn about what we think. Look at how Bush wiretapped us without court orders and had Gonzales and Card try to get Ashcroft to sign off on it while he was in the hospital, under heavy medication and yet Ashcroft still refused to commit high treason against the Constitution by going along with Bush's demonic messengers. But then, I have to doubt that Bush gives much of a damn about the Constitution, either. Remember when he shouted to some congressmen who came to the White House to caution him about shredding the Constitution? "Don't keep throwing the Constitution in my face; it's just a goddamned piece of paper?" Bush told them. Do we need more proof that Bush cares very little for our Republic, our Democracy we used to call America, land of the free?
>
> The only thing that might change the course of Bush's wanton arrogance and disrespect for the rest of the world would be China and Russia combining forces to whup our asses with factories and cheap labor and giant oil reserves, not yet brought up to full capacity and utilization. Just look at us under this president. We are occupying two countries where shooting and killing in the streets is the norm.
>
> For the world to survive, the US needs to wise up and stop occupying nations, depleting our Reserve Army and choking off the world's oil supplies from several countries, many of whom have thermonuclear weapons and sophisticated delivery systems. Forget Iran getting a suitcase bomb. Look to China and Russia. They got 'em. Even after Reagan brought Russia to their knees (Yeah, right). We best remind ourselves to consider the superpowers that might just get pissed off at us enough someday to call us out on our octopus-grabbing diplomacy that reaches out with ships, planes, and high-tech weapons to grab as much oil real estate in the world as Exxon and Halliburton can use to make record profits. Okay, so Might is Right. But still, we best not forget the Chinese and try to cut them off in our oil heist of greed. We had better take heed of their multi-million-man army, manufacturing expertise and evolving technology, not to mention the mammoth numbers of oil-hungry Chinese consumers.
>
> I used to think, "Just wait until the Chinese improve their technology and get big into the auto manufacturing industry." Well, it slipped up on me. Yesterday is today. They've arrived. And China is out to boldly trounce all competition in all the auto manufacturing, no doubt about it. They lead the field already in affordable gasoline, hybrid, and electric cars. The key word here is affordable. Many Chinese car companies are going for the gold in new technology that depends dramatically less upon oil as a fuel while the pig-hungry world oil companies like Exxon continue to laugh at us as gasoline at the pump begins seriously to hurt Americans and the rest of the world.
>
> The Chinese motorcar companies aren't there yet as serious contenders against GM, Toyota, and Nissan. But let's look at some of the facts. For openers, the major car manufacturers in the world have just scratched the surface on alternative energy cars. Toyota's Prius, the world's best hybrid according to Consumer Reports, averages about 46 miles per gallon. And no world large manufacturer will be offering a serious all-electric car in the near future. Why not? Who cares? It appears the Chinese are coming to rescue the world from our dependency on oil.
>
> In March 2007, Tiger Truck announced that it would build the first U.S. assembly plant in Jasper, Texas, for vehicles based on designs by China's third largest car manufacturer, ChangAn Automobile Group. The Jasper facility, on a 92-acre site with a capacity of 7,500 vehicles annually, will employ 100 workers. It's a bold beginning. What is most impressive is that Tiger Trucks is but one of many Chinese car companies who are looking to the future in addressing the problem of rising oil costs. Tiger Trucks manufactures trucks, vans, and cars in all three categories: gasoline and diesel, hybrid, and fully electric. The fully electric Tiger Truck Star, for example is a LSV (Low Speed Vehicle) and can achieve a maximum speed of only 24 MPH, but can carry some hefty payloads of 1500 pounds. For in-town driving, mail carriers, and short runs to the post office and grocery store, they are ideal as an answer to driving conditions where there is street only, stop, and start driving. These fully enclosed, large bed trucks can go up to 50 miles before recharging, but they come with and onboard recharger, too. This Tiger Truck comes with many options, including dump beds, half cabs, and crew cabs. The MSRP is a mere $13,999. You can get one in a gasoline version for $11,795, one in a hybrid or a flex fuel vehicle. The Tiger Truck website is fun to read as one ponders little or no direct fuel cost for a brand, spanking-new vehicle. Quite a contrast when gasoline at the pump averages $3.22 per gallon, eh?
>
> This is China's answer to higher oil prices while Bush's belligerent, bite-me diplomacy of Shock and Awe sends America to the poor house with endless borrowing and spending that sees America in debt now at almost 9 TRILLION DOLLARS. Have we lost our minds? Doesn't history tell us that the Japanese used their ingenuity and abilities to create a wealthy, solvent manufacturing economy and rich country by staying out of world occupation and conflicts? After WW II, they learned their lesson. Is electing a Democrat Congress our only salvation? As Congress fiddles and funds Bush's mad Iraq War without a pullout timetable, what has our country gained? Is our duly elected Democrat majority in both houses impotent because they fear someone might whisper that they do not support the troops? Is that why we went to the ballot box in 2006, to see Bush continue the mad occupation of Iraq, torn by civil war and fragmented theocracies parading as a Purple-Thumb democracy? Are the Democrats all talk? Some of them struggled, voted to fund the troops, and stated that they hated it that their vote to fund enabled Bush to continue his mindless Iraq War. But the result is the same as though they were glad.
>
> We continue to languish in a world gone wrong, one we helped to create and agitate. While we borrow and spend Trillions of dollars we don't have (does bankruptcy ever cross our mind?) China mass-produces world goods and expands the trade deficit with us and other countries. China will need oil, to be sure, and the oil rich countries the USA occupies will definitely be a part of the passion play when China decides it needs more oil sources. Our invading Iran right now to sew up 2 out of 3 of the world's biggest pools of oil might make China extremely nervous, if not downright angry.
>
> It's probably best that we cannot see into the future. But one thing is certain, and that is that the oil crunch drama will play out soon. Meanwhile, America seems hopelessly stuck in the state of producing weapons and weapons technology. Perhaps war is the only profitable world business America can hope for in the 21st Century. And keeping enough of the weapons you produce insures the ability to attack another country, Iraq, for instance, at will. Especially since Iraq is the second largest oil source in the world. And might is right, right? Maybe that's our legacy. Or our insanity if we do not change course. Instead, we rattle sabers at Iran, the third richest oil deposit in the world. The future looks grim. It appears that even a majority of the American people cannot elect a Congress to do the right thing. One misunderstood Bushism in a world of agitated world powers with real weapons, might light the match. We cannot live in a World Turned Upside Down. We must don our White Hat again and be an inspiration to the world, not a bully. We must change course.
>
> --
> "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution
> inevitable." - JFK
>
>
--
Larry
"The power of the Executive to cast a man into prison without formulating any charge known to the law, and particularly to deny him the judgment of his peers, is in the highest degree odious and is the foundation of all totalitarian government whether Nazi or Communist".
Winston Churchhill
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